Dawn (00:00):
Hello, and welcome to the Gastric Health Show. My name is Dawn Boxell, Registered Dietitian, and I’m excited to share with you this week a two-part series, an interview with Dr. Kristen Lloyd. She’s a highly accomplished psychotherapist, transformational mindset coach, a college educator and a consultant. She is also a certified reque master, A certified hypnotherapist certified an EFT tapping practitioner.
Dawn (00:31):
And Dr. Kristen is a bestselling author of Bariatric Mindset Success and Release Your Regain. So today’s topic, motivation. I know what to do. Why don’t I do it? Dr. Lloyd has come up with five key points that we are going to discuss. Welcome, Dr. Lloyd. We’re excited to have you on the show. Me. Absolutely. Okay, let’s roll right into those five key points. When it comes to motivation, I know what to do. Why don’t I do it?
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (01:06):
The five that I wrote down, and they will all intermingle.
Dawn (01:11):
Okay.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (01:11):
Are projection.
Dawn (01:13):
Okay.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (01:14):
Rejection, loss aversion, which I also have next to loss aversion is pleasure over pain. Okay. Identity and mental health. So when we talk about, I know what to do, why don’t I do it? Not in any specific order, but the projection priorities. We can talk about priorities and competing priorities. One of the things I see a ton are individuals who have emotionally immature, have come from emotionally immature families.
Dawn (01:58):
Okay? Yep.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (01:59):
Lindsay Gibson’s book, adult Children of Emotionally immature parents, I refer people to a lot. Has nothing to do with weight. Nothing.
Dawn (02:07):
Nothing. No. Right.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (02:10):
I need to meet everyone else’s needs and there’s nothing left for me.
Dawn (02:17):
Yeah. I understand that.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (02:21):
With food, with emotions, with energy, with movement, with stress, with sleep, I have to do it all. So there’s a perfectionism theme.
Dawn (02:33):
Yep.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (02:34):
So where does the projection come in? I have to project that I have it together. I am not allowed to show weakness, but I’m falling apart. Right. I’m falling apart. Right. I don’t know what I’m doing and I know what to do, but I don’t do it. But I’m mentally and emotionally exhausted. And the O word, I hear it on a constantly everyday basis.
Dawn (03:04):
Yeah.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (03:05):
Overwhelm.
Dawn (03:06):
Yeah. And
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (03:07):
It’s so used, and it’s not a criticism and it’s an awareness. So it’s so used, overused that what happens, I think neurophysiologically is the minute that someone says I’m overwhelmed, it flips them into an even it. It’s so programmed that they go into a physiological shutdown and then they scroll, they shame themselves for scrolling, and it’s not about can’t. Although that’s what it feels like. So then we go into mental, then we can piggyback on mental health and depression. Am I depressed? But what’s really fascinating is this projection of having to be all the things for everyone else also creates resentment.
Dawn (04:05):
Oh yeah. I could see that.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (04:08):
And it also creates a rejection of self.
Dawn (04:13):
Interesting. Okay. Because why does that create a rejection of yourself?
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (04:22):
Because the priorities, if the priorities dictate where you’re spending your time and your energy, there’s nothing left. And the other part is psychologically what we know is self-care, personal hygiene, showering.
Dawn (04:53):
Right.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (04:55):
Cooking food. Things that we see are basic, basic human life skills, basic human needs for oneself. Those become exhausting. How that becomes a rejection of self is those get pushed to the back burner. And now we’re focused on how can I receive pleasure?
Dawn (05:28):
Because that’s supposed, that should feel better.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (05:31):
That should feel better.
Dawn (05:32):
It should feel better.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (05:35):
So I’m going to go and find something pleasurable, and I don’t have a lot of time and I certainly don’t have energy. So what are the choices? And there’s the should do.
Dawn (05:50):
Yeah.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (05:51):
I should do this. Yeah. That’s what my medical team says I should do. That’s what everyone says I should do. But that’s uncomfortable, right? Yeah. That’s uncomfortable and that’s not fun. Okay. So here’s another way that we can look through the lens of dopamine depleted. And I want fun. I want pleasure. And then the brain wants what’s fun and pleasurable. And until you’ve made peace, which that’s complex, but unless,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (06:37):
until you’ve made peace with all food is equal, or how am I needing my needs? Or if you’re seeking pleasure solely from food, because other areas of your life are, I don’t know, am I allowed to cuss on here? Which is kind of like, yeah. Right. When the rest of your life is kind of exploding and you’re like, you know what I’m, you are then worn down. So you’ve gotten to a point of decision fatigue.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (07:14):
And then we go through the shame s spiral. So you’re certainly not that individual’s not saying, you know what, I’m going to have some chicken and broccoli tonight. Right. They’re not excited about that. They’re not excited about that. It is. There’s the seeking out of the highly palatable foods to pivot because there hasn’t been an equality of, wow, not only is this good for me, but I I’m actually going to be able to notice these complex flavors or where there is a chicken, don’t, I’m just giving an example.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (07:56):
Some grilled chicken with some asparagus and some risotto or something. Our folks are not eating that. Maybe some are, but Right. You know what I mean? We’re not like the folks that I work with are, and maybe that you work with, the stuff that’s gravitating is usually very either very specific, crunchy, sweet, salty. Agreed. Right. It’s going to give you, yeah. That hit pretty quickly. But the loss aversion piece is don’t take my binky. Yeah. This is my Gollum, like my precious. So in some ways I tell them, I am not here to take your binky. I’m not here to take your binky. But that is when we see food,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (09:04):
There’s also this, I cannot continue this pattern of doing this over and over and over. So then we’re, we’re going to touch on all of these things to some extent, and then I’ll share the different layers, the loss aversion, and I put a definition so that we can, it’s actually behavioral economics term. It’s not even
Dawn (09:30):
Really, really?
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (09:31):
Yes. It’s not even used in this, but it can go a couple different things. Loss aversion is a cognitive bias where for individuals, the pain of losing something is psychologically twice as painful as the pleasure of gaining something else.
Dawn (09:50):
Interesting. That is interesting.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (09:55):
So it’s usually discussed in terms of money, a value object and a swapping out when, and this is a term that I twitch at, but I have to say it because I think people will understand when I was prior to surgery, and I would hear the say, the saying, nothing tastes as good as skinny feels. Ooh. I hate that saying. Yeah.
Dawn (10:26):
Yes,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (10:26):
Yes. I am not a fan, so I want everybody to know. Right. I am not using that term. What I see in that though is that whoever originated that term was trying to get people to feel, to choose the long-term gain over the short-term loss. The problem is that term shames people.
Dawn (10:56):
True.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (10:57):
And it doesn’t validate the short-term.
Dawn (11:02):
Yeah.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (11:03):
Loss. Nor does it give credit to shifting one’s mindset around food. And so we need to address the loss aversion in the binky and build new coping skills. But it’s just not just the coping skills, it’s looking at, here’s another term that I didn’t put up here, but it’s just as important, is the secondary gain, which has nothing to do with laws immersion, but the secondary gain that we receive from continuing the same behavior over and over and over, when we realize, what am I doing here? When we continually repeat a, it doesn’t have anything to know with knowing or not whether it’s good for us,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (11:57):
but the secondary gain is we’re getting something from it. So if every night somebody’s having a ice cream sundae and they’re like, why am I night eating? Why am I doing this? If I know, say, know what to do, why am I not doing it? What are you getting from it? So secondary gain is that if it’s not serving you on a primary level, if that’s not intention, there’s a secondary gain. You’re getting something from it. So sabotage, whenever somebody talks to me about sabotage, what are you getting from it?
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (12:35):
You’re getting something. And
Dawn (12:39):
Would you say mostly that’s kind of like they’re getting some type of boost in their mood? Are they getting just some energy? I mean those type of things? Or are you meaning different?
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (12:55):
Different,
Dawn (12:55):
Okay.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (12:56):
This is where I go really deep. Okay. And I say this because years ago, and I used the same example this morning on a group call. You did? Yes. So years ago, I was working with a woman and she came to me for emotional eating. And very quickly within the first couple of sessions, I realized her marriage was a point of contention. They got married out of necessity. He had some financial troubles. She was well off. She covered some of his medical expenses. She liked him, loved him, but knew she wasn’t in love with him.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (13:45):
Long story short, he was very opinionated and she really struggled with voicing, using her voice, speaking up for herself. And he was really great companionship. There was value to that relationship. And I’m not saying that there wasn’t, but early on I was giving her the very basic coping tools that I would is it’s almost like you find, I have tons of coping tools, but it’s like, what works best for you, Dawn? What works best for you, Mary? What works best for you? You go through what’s going to work best for your life. But those things are typically, those things are first what we may think of as a first responder.
Dawn (14:39):
Yeah.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (14:40):
Because there’s usually something much deeper in terms of attachment, like attachment issues. When I think of attachment is how we attach to our primary caregiver. Attachment issues impact how we walk in the world. Secure attachment, avoid an attachment, insecure or anxious attachment. If there’s codependency, if there’s trauma, those things impact how you walk in the world because of how you are or aren’t validated in your primary relationships. And very early, she’s like, this isn’t working. This isn’t working. These two ones aren’t working. Now. It wasn’t that she wasn’t working the tools, but they weren’t enough because she had set a boundary with me, which is, I’m not going to address the relationship stuff.
Dawn (15:50):
Oh, wow.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (15:51):
Not, and wasn’t with me. It was with him. I’m not going to do A, B, or C. And it was like, well, we’re pretty much done here. Right? Cause that’s the source. And then in terms of, I’m not going to feel my feelings because here’s what happened the last time I did that. It’s like, well, maybe you need to go to therapy and work on that. Because it was a coaching dynamic. It was not a therapy dynamic. And it was like, I think this is what’s going to, so redirect, why that’s important is what I want to do is help people see what the core issues are.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (16:34):
If they need therapy, go to therapy to work on that. If it’s couples therapy, if it’s individual therapy, if some new things have popped up, there are certain tools that I can give insight information, a context in terms of where to move. And the thing that’s powerful about that, it shaves years off of self discovery and exploration then if they were to go into therapy and try to piece all of these puzzle pieces together.
Dawn (17:08):
Yeah. Okay. That’s awesome.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (17:11):
So that is one example of this. What am I willing to look at or not willing to look at in my life? And because
Dawn (17:25):
There’s always more,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (17:27):
There’s, I’ve not ever met someone who’s in my practice. Maybe there are other people that it’s just food. I’ve not met anyone. I bet not. But maybe that’s also because of what I do. Now, there also, do I also meet people who have gut issues? Yes. Do I also meet people who are perpetually don taking antibiotics?
Dawn (18:00):
Right? Oh, yeah. Yeah.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (18:04):
I, but that’s not my, like,
Dawn (18:08):
Right.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (18:10):
Do I meet people who are struggling with food choices or that kind of stuff who are workaholics? And then that’s another way to avoid dealing with things, or it’s looking at also, who are you? And the thing that I ask most frequently once I’ve built rapport is, what do you want beyond weight loss?
Dawn (18:48):
Oh yeah, that’s good.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (18:50):
What do you want beyond weight loss? Because if you don’t know what you want beyond weight loss,
Dawn (18:58):
Right?
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (19:01):
What are you going to get from the weight loss? And a lot of people say confidence. Great. Confidence to do what?
Dawn (19:09):
To do what? Exactly. Exactly. I a hundred percent. I would agree 100%. Because I feel like over the years at the beginning, you counseling people, you’re like, okay, yeah, you will feel better and you will have more confidence and you will be able to go do these things. But do they end up do becoming that different person in a way that sets them up for long-term success, that now they’re no longer needing a diet, they’re no longer needing support in that way?
Dawn (19:46):
No. That was, it was like they just got stuck in that chronic, this was just another diet. It was just another diet. It was just another diet. And they never really dug in deep enough to really see that, okay, I want to do this for my health, or I want to do this so I can go to college, or if I want to get this promotion and take over, become the C e O or whatever you know, have in you, because we’re all here, in my opinion, for a purpose.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (20:20):
Yes. Agree. Agree.
Dawn (20:21):
So is I saying the two most important days in your life or the day you’re born, or the day you discover why you were born? Why? Yeah. Yeah. I don’t, as a society, I don’t feel like,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (20:41):
Amen. Yes, amen.
Dawn (20:43):
The majority of us,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (20:44):
No, no, no.
Dawn (20:45):
Have that upbringing or that ability to gather that ourselves. I mean, it’s unfortunate.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (20:57):
It is.
Dawn (20:59):
But here we are with a society full of people who don’t know. True. They think weight loss is the solution.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (21:11):
It’s not,
Dawn (21:13):
No.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (21:13):
Cause what will happen as, and I know that they get there to this magical place where the clouds do not part, the birds do not sing. The angels are not harping, nothing happens any different. The
Dawn (21:30):
Husband’s not nice anymore, but now he’s not nice. The kids aren’t sweet and chair and sit, listen to you when you told them to. No,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (21:41):
Nothing changes.
Dawn (21:43):
No.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (21:44):
And you might be able to wear those cute pink shorts or whatever. And
Dawn (21:53):
What value is that?
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (21:55):
What value is that? Is that if there is a vision, and then they’re like, okay, I’m here. And then,
Dawn (22:05):
Yes,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (22:05):
The reality of all of the life stressors, maybe the short term work, because this is work anyway. Look at it. If you are focused on, all I have to do is get here. Any of us can do something for the short term. If your focus is, all I have to do is get here, then what shows up after is a resentment for what you gave up, which in that person’s mind was they’re precious. And then it comes back in. And or if there is some executive functioning stuff, they’re flying by the seat of their pants potentially. And not even in a mindful state of, oh, I’m doing this, I’m doing this. Right. And that catches up.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (23:14):
But then we have the mental health, anxiety, depression. The top three that I see are depression, anxiety, and attention deficit or executive functioning issues. Those are the top three that I see. Okay. It’s not to say that there aren’t other complex mental health issues, but the thing that shows up with that is also a pattern. Big words today, big words of learned helplessness and victim mentality.
Dawn (23:48):
Ooh. Yeah. Yikes. Those are, yeah,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (23:52):
For me,
Dawn (23:53):
Yes. Yep. I can’t do that. I
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (23:56):
Can’t do that.
Dawn (23:57):
I can’t do that.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (23:58):
You don’t understand. So
Dawn (24:02):
What gets someone to that? What gets, and yes, I know life and things happen, but you can have siblings grow up in the same house and experience life so differently. And yet one is a victim
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (24:23):
And one isn’t,
Dawn (24:25):
And one isn’t.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (24:28):
And yeah. Could we look at adult children of, again, back to that adult children of emotionally? Yeah. Immature parents, codependency. We can look at ACE scores. We can look, if you guys don’t know what ace is, is adverse childhood experiences. But those are still not, although the research may say one thing, but I’ve also known a lot of people who have overcome what their A score said that they would be. So they’ve persevered. Right. And I tend to look for the outliers in terms of the people who persevere. And that is, there may need to be research on why or how certain people persevere
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (25:22):
because it doesn’t necessarily have to be, some of it could be envir, but I’ve also known people who have been in horrible, horrific environments, and they are scrappy as hell. They are, yeah. They’re, you’ve ever heard that phrase? Throw me to the wolves and I’ll come back. The leader of the pack. There are those. And that’s where I like to talk about learned helplessness, because we are given a choice. We can adopt and believe the circumstances, or we can pivot and work through them and overcome them.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (26:21):
And not to, I kind of want to circle back because I don’t want to get too far off topic, but a thing that you said a little while ago is how do people get into self-rejection?
Dawn (26:35):
Yeah.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (26:38):
Patterns. But it be, it’s that even that pattern, when I discuss self-rejection or it’s not an overt, I’m rejecting myself. It is by virtue of I’m struggling to make ends meet. I’m doing the best that I can. And I do believe that people are doing the best that they can with what they have. And that includes their line of thinking, because we’re Yeah. True. We model, we have modeled our family figures, so Sure. Absolutely.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (27:26):
Social learning theory, right? Yeah. We model what we’ve seen and then we attract into our lives. Either we, so there’s a lot of, there’s another theory about we tend to attract the same type of relationships to create a resolution if it hasn’t been resolved. Or if you’re used to the cycle of abuse, there are people who may be right or continue to perpetuate that cycle of abuse in adult relationships.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (27:58):
Not everyone. Not everyone. But it’s important to look at a lot of those patterns or dynamics. And we’ll see it in different groups where people will talk about the divorce rate for bariatric patients being so high. I have my own theories on it, but some of which are maybe patterns of abuse. But S or others could be like they were settling, they didn’t know who they were. It was maybe an unhealthy relationship to begin with. A lot of different things. And I’m not necessarily trying to make this all about relationships either, but that rejection of self can be a byproduct of, I’ve got to, I’ve do all these things, whatever the priorities are, but at the same time, the same reason that I was talking earlier,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (28:59):
when the dust settles and somebody’s going to the fridge, if I have to work on me, that individual has to work on themselves. And they don’t know who they are. They don’t know what they want. And that becomes, here we go with the over word again. Overwhelming. You know what? It’s easier to pick up a extra five hours at work. It’s easier to be a good duty and do, for somebody over here. It’s easier to show up at this church function. It’s easier to
Dawn (29:41):
Name, put anything in that place.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (29:44):
Insert here. Yep. Than to work on myself. If you have some victim learned helplessness. Well, I just had a couple brownies. Why go to the gym? Why bother? Right. So there’s this other, it’s because also the diet mentality for so many years is movement is punishment. Yeah. I don’t like it for many. I’m not saying it’s for all.
Dawn (30:17):
Yep.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (30:18):
It’s something that I have to do, not something that I want to do. And now there’s, I’m not happy in these layers of my life. Work is long, work is hard. I’m giving so much of myself, resentment. People take, and if you have a bunch of nurses, I’m just going to say this. If you have a bunch of nurses who are already lovers, givers over givers.
Dawn (30:50):
Yep.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (30:50):
Highly compassionate, empathetic people
Dawn (30:54):
Who
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (30:56):
Are giving so much to others, and then they’re working a 12 or 15 hour day. I kind of described something a little earlier, not, and it’s not that, it’s not even about self-aware. Some people might be self-aware, some people might not.
Dawn (31:20):
Right.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (31:20):
But there’s nothing left for them at the end of the day. And for them to say, well, why don’t I do it? Okay, well, there’s ener. Is it motivation or is it energy?
Dawn (31:34):
Yeah.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (31:35):
Where are you getting your energy? Where are you replenishing?
Dawn (31:39):
Yeah. Your
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (31:41):
Cup.
Dawn (31:41):
Yep.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (31:42):
We have passive relaxation versus active relaxation. Passive is numbing out, scrolling, watching tv. You don’t replenish your energy that way. You replenish your energy through an active relaxation. The research shows that, and
Dawn (31:58):
Give some examples of some active relaxation,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (32:01):
Walking, forest, bathing, yoga, stretching,
Dawn (32:10):
Physical, something that includes some type of physical movement. Could it be even
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (32:16):
Also be quilting, which isn’t necessarily, but
Dawn (32:22):
It’s an exercise.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (32:23):
An exercise. But it could be a quilting or a knitting, because it’s more of, it’s mindful.
Dawn (32:34):
Okay.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (32:40):
But there is an action there. It’s not always physical in terms of an exercise. Another one could be, although I don’t think of this as exercise, but it could be playing pool or table tennis.
Dawn (32:56):
Okay. Yeah. Right.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (32:59):
Yeah.
Dawn (33:01):
So I think that that’s good because I think that gives people information and insight to, okay, what is this? Do I really have to just exercise? Or can that account for,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (33:16):
Well, I mean, I think that there are so many things, and you probably know more than I do when we are, it’s like a body in motion stays in motion. We are going that movement. There are so many things that comes out of it. And I tell my people, move for mental health. I don’t usually use the word exercise or fitness because they twitch. And so I find that’s another thing is, and I’ve played with the idea of writing a whole book about opera using operational definitions, because the word healthy makes some of my clients twitch. And I’ll ask them, what does healthy mean to you? You’ve got to define it. And they liter, there are so many people that literally go, I don’t know.
Dawn (34:09):
Oh, wow.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (34:11):
So when we say, why don’t I do it? A lot of times it’s because they don’t know what they’re getting.
Dawn (34:20):
No.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (34:22):
They don’t know. Why am I doing this thing? I know that it’s going to help me lose weight. But there is an emotional internal resistance, and they don’t know what it is. And it’s uncomfortable and it’s sitting in an uncomfortable
Dawn (34:40):
Place.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (34:41):
And when we talk about discomfort, you mean to tell me I have to exercise? I hate that. You mean to tell me I have to go do this. And it’s maybe because their friend Amy told them that they were going, that she was going to CrossFit, and they were like, oh my gosh, I don’t want to do that. Right. But then maybe somebody else loves that. Right? You do.
Dawn (35:06):
Yep.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (35:07):
It’s, why don’t people take action? Why do folks struggle the perception that it’s going to be painful? It’s not fun.
Dawn (35:19):
Yeah.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (35:19):
The perception that it’s n it’s, they’re losing something. Loss aversion. They’re losing their coping mechanism. They’re losing their best friend at some points, depending on how they, they’re losing pleasure. Well, here’s the thing. If that’s the only pleasure they’ve had,
Dawn (35:41):
Yeah,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (35:43):
Because work sucks. My relationship sucks. My finances suck. What do they have? I know it sounds depressing, like I’m not trying to be depressing, but
Dawn (35:55):
No, no, we have,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (35:57):
Then there I will ask, what is it that you want? What is it that you want? And sometimes it’s too big of a question. So I have different, a lot of times use the very basic life coaching wellness wheel.
Dawn (36:17):
Yes. We
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (36:18):
All know about to go, what do you want in this area? What do you want in this area? What do you want in this area?
Dawn (36:25):
Yep.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (36:25):
Breed yourself in those areas.
Dawn (36:28):
Yep.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (36:29):
Identity. Who are you?
Dawn (36:32):
Right?
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (36:32):
Who are you when you’re not nursing? Who are you when you’re not serving? and Who are you when you’re not helping? Who are you when you are not othering?
Dawn (36:44):
Yep.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (36:45):
So the other piece, the food. Why don’t I do these things? The very basic answer, working on myself is hard.
Dawn (36:58):
eah.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (36:59):
Healing the wound. I don’t want to see sitting. I want to, if I just lose weight, it’ll be better. The thing that a lot of people don’t recognize is what’s underneath the weight.
Dawn (37:20):
Yes.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (37:22):
And then there’s even more shame potentially when if they go through menopause because there’s hormonal stuff and then there’s self blame, shame or guilt for the hormonal changes or the hormonal urges. And why can’t I just Right. What’s wrong with me? And now they condemn themselves
Dawn (37:50):
Which again, if they have that victim mentality, can get them really stuck in a place because then they don’t think they can, and they don’t have maybe the awareness, I mean, they’re ignoring the awareness to, at some level, if they’re really having a victim mentality, they’re not accepting that awareness to I do have a choice,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (38:24):
Or I’m already, I’m so, I’m so flawed that it doesn’t matter. And that’s the thing is none of us are ever going to be perfect. Right. Right. So
Dawn (38:39):
Exactly.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (38:41):
The other piece about projection, and I meant this when I wrote the note to myself, but I forgot about this. So you have somebody who’s say, been sexually abused. Yep. There’s also, it’s not so much a projection, but it’s the F, they may not consciously think the weight has been a protection mechanism. So protection is another one where if I’m, the weight is protecting me from potentially getting abused again.
Dawn (39:18):
True. Yep. Oh yeah.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (39:20):
Yep. So they’re like, why can’t I? I know what to do. But if you start losing and you start to get attention, okay, I’ve had people say this to me before and then comes back up.
Dawn (39:36):
Yep. Oh yeah. So
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (39:38):
The protection, the other projection protection, the weight as a protection or the habits as a protection. Because if somebody is continuing the same patterns, it pr, it’s a protection from them actually having to go through an ego death or a protection for them actually having to deal with childhood issues or actually having to deal with their marriage or their job or their boss. Or using where they actually are using their voice. Voice is big. Voice is big. Or they’ll actually have to be vulnerable. Because what people don’t realize is that when, well, when you’re bigger, you’re invisible.
Dawn (40:38):
As
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (40:38):
You lose weight and you’re more visible and people see you, then there’s a different expectation. Not that you didn’t have expectations before when you were larger, but we’ve also got to address that There is Is weight bias. There is weight bias. Yes. So now why you don’t do it. This is all subconscious, by the way. Nobody’s doing. Nobody’s thinking
Dawn (41:10):
Intentionally. No. Nope. But
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (41:15):
The patterns that continually come up now, are they woven into the dopamine and the serotonin,
Dawn (41:25):
Right? Yeah.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (41:28):
But they’re also driven by the freeze state or the sympathetic, the activated state.
Dawn (41:38):
Yeah.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (41:39):
We’re talking nurses. How many are in an activated sympathetic state all day long and then they come back home and they’re in a freeze.
Dawn (41:48):
Yeah. So how say someone is in that free state, they’re not maybe even Sure they are, but they think I probably could be in a free state. How does one get themselves out of that mean? Do you have to do certain types of therapy or, yes.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (42:18):
I would highly recommend somatic experiencing.
Dawn (42:22):
Yeah, okay.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (42:23):
A somatic practitioner, because coming out of freeze, it’s movement is a great way to come out of freeze. Your peeps are going to be like, darn
Dawn (42:43):
It. Dang it. Whole thing
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (42:44):
Is movement, but very, very specific. The other, we want movement. But how you get out of how you work through, it’s working through more than it is getting out of. Right. Because we normally go through a sympathetic, we’re activated all day long. If I’m going to the grocery store and somebody stops, this is one of the ways that I explain it is somebody stops really fast and you throw on the brakes and you’re like,
Dawn (43:19):
Okay, I almost
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (43:20):
Hit that guy. You’re going to go through an activation and then you’ll go through a settling and it’s, we go in and out of those states all day. The window of tolerance. Right. And when you’re, when you go through a prolonged activation, that’s where, and I’m sure through your work, you may even notice some adrenal fatigue. Right. And some
Dawn (43:56):
HPA access dysregulation, more of that.
Dawn (43:56):
HPA access dysregulation, more of that.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (43:59):
Yes. So when there are things that are going to be soothing for someone physiologically to come out of an activated state, when somebody goes into freeze, there’s usually a lot more immobilization. I just want to sleep. I just want to numb, dissociated. And the food can help with that.
Dawn (44:28):
Yeah. I could see.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (44:31):
And that’s over time leading to, I consider it self-harming because it’s not contributing to longevity, health wellness
(44:49)
In the long term. It’s, it’s that idea, and I don’t know if you’ve heard this. It’s what you used at a coping mechanism originally as a trauma response may have protected you. It was used as a protection mechanism. The cookies under the stairs when your parents were fighting or the things that you did to avoid an abuser or all of those things, they protected you at one point in time. And now that coping mechanism is now at a point where it’s become, we’ve got to change it, but we can’t just replace the coping mechanism. We’ve also got to address the underlying physiological drive and the habit pattern and the environment. Or triggers. Use triggers. And then the other piece that with triggers, we identifying triggers. But what this is used a lot in somatic experiencing as well, the glimmers.
Dawn (46:03):
Okay,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (46:03):
What are the things that drive hope? What are the things that spark joy?
Dawn (46:09):
Right.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (46:10):
We talk about triggers, but we don’t talk enough about glimmers.
Dawn (46:14):
Yeah, no, that’s good.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (46:16):
Protection is that we are hardwired for fear.
Dawn (46:22):
Yeah.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (46:24):
Where’s the fear response? So a lot of times things are for pro protection, but if that protection at an early age was rejection because it was fueled through, I need to take care of their needs, and now I’m in the good girl or boy, when I start to read the room, I need to not have feelings. I need to not make noise, not cry. Then you learned in early childhood to reject using your voice to reject your own needs.
Dawn (47:12):
That makes me think of just healthcare workers.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (47:16):
Yeah.
Dawn (47:17):
Does it set them up for going into healthcare? Because they were kind of already trained to not, I remember just being in college for becoming a dietician. We had counseling classes and they would teach, you can’t show emotion to the person so that you disrupt how they feel,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (47:44):
And
Dawn (47:45):
You need to
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (47:46):
Want them to turn around and care take you.
Dawn (47:49):
Yep. Yep. So you have to, and you can’t act surprised. And I remember, and you talking about some patients that have maybe been raped or sexually abused, and they put on the weight because of that. So they’re no longer attractive. And I remember it would’ve been probably ’96, 90…1997, something like that. I had my first 600 pound patient. She was in her twenties. Her parents were both healthcare workers and they wanted her to have bariatric surgery. And our whole program went through this big review.
Dawn (48:30):
And when I had did my part with her, that was what came out. She had been raped as a 13 year old, and she just started eating because she was like, I did not want to look attractive to anyone. She would have these big binges. And I remember, I just remember in my training, I’m like, okay, I can’t show emotion. But yet after that, I’m just blown away. I mean a half of a sheet cake, then go in and get a pizza. And then, I mean, it just went on. And I’m just like, oh, my heart just broke. I’m just like, oh my gosh. You have, yeah. No idea. Until you’re one-on-one with those people. And they’re really
Explaining how they got to where they are. And it’s not even their fault.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (49:29):
And the thing is that, so there’s the physical abuse, there’s the sexual abuse, there’s
Dawn (49:42):
Emotional.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (49:43):
Yes. I have a client,
Dawn (49:46):
A verbal,
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (49:47):
Yes. I have a client right now. Her parents would give her the silent treatment as a child, as a form of punishment. So essentially what you grow up to internalize is not so much I’m invisible, but I don’t matter. So you have that as a child, I don’t matter. And here’s another one, I don’t matter. And the thing, and I see this a lot, is women. Cause I work mostly with women.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhDÂ (50:25)
Women whose mothers put them on diets at five and seven and nine. I pick an age, it doesn’t matter. They did it and and the diet started early. And so their worth was equated. So now we’re trying to pull apart. Your worth is not equal to the scale. They cannot conceptualize it because when you’ve been told that your entire life, your worth is equal. So then what you create is a dynamic of a fight with food. Because food in a lot of ways is a socially acceptable outlet. And it’s, it’s absolutely commercialized.
Dr. Kristin Lloyd, PhD (51:15):
Bridget Jones diary is my favorite example, where she goes through her breakup and she’s having, I don’t remember if it was Hogans or Ben and Jerry’s. Very, and we’re not going to get out of food is celebration. We’re not going to change. But when you work with somebody who’s lost, yeah. 40, 50 pounds, and their spouse takes them out to dinner, it creates a different dynamic because, and I’m getting, but then food is reward. And it really disrupts a change in how they see food and how they interact with food and their relationship with themselves. Validating. Nurturing. Yeah. Or not versus escaping. But then the other part is eat this. Right? So cultures, depending on your culture, eat this. Why aren’t you eating? Da da da da da. And then don’t get that.
Dawn (52:28):
Okay. This is where we’re ending part one. So next week, join us back for part two of motivation. I know what to do, why don’t I do it.
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